Kremlin Imperial Stout

[Paul84]

Hey All , 

Only on second fermentation with my first two brewprints , a Narci-Citrus and a Ruby Porter. I have got a box of the Kremlin I.S. thinking this batch i will do as is . But i love barrel aged stouts ( especially ones that have been in bourbon barrels ) what do you thinl of me doing a second fermentation in a oak barrel i can hold some bourbon in ... or add some bourbon on keg fill to add those bourbon notes ? 

 

[Captain 3 Droids]

Hi Paul84, Mark here. I did a secondary fermentation of and imperial stout in a just emptied 10l port barrel. Left it in there for 2 weeks then bottled in glass. With the early tastings the port dominated however after about 6 months it had smoothed out and was delicious. I kept some bottles for a few years and it just kept on improving.

How big a barrel are you looking at? Will it have dried out? If it has had bourbon in it I’d go with just that and not add, the oak/bourbon combination should be great.

Cheers.

[Weissbock]

Hi, Paul, Sounds interesting!  I love I stouts !  At 9.5% wonder how long it will need to smooth out?  Bet it will be a nice one!

Even the craft breweries here in the states brew some great i stout, my fave is North Coast old rasputin.  Still the best ris i've ever had was a Nøgne Ø Imperial Stout Grimstad, Norway.   9.0% ABV. 75 IBU.  I thought it would be over roasted but was more like an imperial porter on bitterness which suited me fine!  Good luck with it!

[Paul84]

@Barrelboy, i am not sure i am tossing up the idea atm . You can buy new American Oak Barrels so was thinking of just going small batch and getting a 2-3 litre barrel , then filling it with a bourbon and let that sit for 60 days or so . Then refill with the Imperial stout for another 60-90 days, i am thinking long game here haha . 

@Weissbock, yeah man i love the Barrel aged stouts , i hunt for them atm lol so much body and the sultana/caramel flavors of bourbon really shine in them . I keep collecting the Goose Island Bourbon Count Stouts and they are 13-15%  

[Captain 3 Droids]

7 minutes ago, Paul84 said:

@Barrelboy, i am not sure i am tossing up the idea atm . You can buy new American Oak Barrels so was thinking of just going small batch and getting a 2-3 litre barrel , then filling it with a bourbon and let that sit for 60 days or so . Then refill with the Imperial stout for another 60-90 days, i am thinking long game here haha . 

@Weissbock, yeah man i love the Barrel aged stouts , i hunt for them atm lol so much body and the sultana/caramel flavors of bourbon really shine in them . I keep collecting the Goose Island Bourbon Count Stouts and they are 13-15%  

That would be ok, I’d be taking a sample from the barrel every now and again during the course of the 90 days just in case the bourbon gets too dominant.

[Paul84]

So as an update. I have been continuing to look into this as the outlay of the barrel and the time to cure it then cycle some bourbon through is something now sure I will do at this stage, also because it is a one shot thing . Ill only get 1 run at using the barrel as a first fill. Especially if it turns out terrible lol... i have also searched and lots of homebrewers just use whisky soaked Oak Cubes for second fermentation. Can anyone see an issue with me doing a 2 week secondary fermentation in a carboy before bottling ? How would that work with the sugars ,, should I add enough for the yeast to keep alive and then sugar again when bottling for carbonation ? 

However this batch of RIS I am thinking of sticking to the 12 long necks and having 3 original , 3 Bourbon added, 3 Port Added and 3 Peated Whisky . But gonna lowbrow it and just throw a tablespoon of spirit in each bottle, more to see what I like if I want to keep experimenting, thoughts/feelings? Do you think the yeast will stand up to the slightly higher abv ? 

Edited December 3, 2019 by Paul84

[Captain 3 Droids]

36 minutes ago, Paul84 said:

So as an update. I have been continuing to look into this as the outlay of the barrel and the time to cure it then cycle some bourbon through is something now sure I will do at this stage, also because it is a one shot thing . Ill only get 1 run at using the barrel as a first fill. Especially if it turns out terrible lol... i have also searched and lots of homebrewers just use whisky soaked Oak Cubes for second fermentation. Can anyone see an issue with me doing a 2 week secondary fermentation in a carboy before bottling ? How would that work with the sugars ,, should I add enough for the yeast to keep alive and then sugar again when bottling for carbonation ? 

However this batch of RIS I am thinking of sticking to the 12 long necks and having 3 original , 3 Bourbon added, 3 Port Added and 3 Peated Whisky . But gonna lowbrow it and just throw a tablespoon of spirit in each bottle, more to see what I like if I want to keep experimenting, thoughts/feelings? Do you think the yeast will stand up to the slightly higher abv ? 

I wouldn’t be adding any more sugar at the secondary fermentation, the yeast will be dormant so to speak but will activate when you bottle and add the sugar then for carbonation.

I don’t know how adding a teaspoon of the spirits to bottles will work out, never done it. Will be interesting.

[Weissbock]

Guessing you took an og reading?  have you now checked fg?  If close to expected fg /abv% i would certainly transfer to secondary, if nothing else to get it off the trub making for a cleaner final product.  secondary is meant for that, after transfer check fg after 3 days or so.  no change in fg?  it's done fermenting.  You dont want to add more yeast or sugar. probably will take 6-9 months for taste to get there. hope for the best on it!

[Paul84]

26 minutes ago, Barrelboy said:

I wouldn’t be adding any more sugar at the secondary fermentation, the yeast will be dormant so to speak but will activate when you bottle and add the sugar then for carbonation.

I don’t know how adding a teaspoon of the spirits to bottles will work out, never done it. Will be interesting.

Yeah thats cool then , i might try the oak cubes in a carboy for secondary then next time I do an RIS if this works out.  Time will tell if spirits in the final product will.work or not lol . This is long game stuff. I am going to bottle it all so I can sample month to month . 

Most guys who homebrew for "barrel age" with the oak cube secondary usually have an amount of spirit in it aswell , the soak is all added . Differing opinions on the amounts though lol, i am just going conservative. Want the flavor to infuse not overpower

[Weissbock]

note:  I'm paranoid on oxidation, if you have a c02 charger i would purge the carboy of oxygen before transfer, and top it off with more c02 before attaching airlock.  c02 charger is abkut $10.00 usd, well worth it.

[Paul84]

27 minutes ago, Weissbock said:

Guessing you took an og reading?  have you now checked fg?  If close to expected fg /abv% i would certainly transfer to secondary, if nothing else to get it off the trub making for a cleaner final product.  secondary is meant for that, after transfer check fg after 3 days or so.  no change in fg?  it's done fermenting.  You dont want to add more yeast or sugar. probably will take 6-9 months for taste to get there. hope for the best on it!

Havent even started the brew yet @weissbock. And i am yet to buy a refractometer to measure the OG and FG lol.

 On my to do list lol. 

Thinking the small amountbif spirit wont change the FG much, and as I said above want it to infuse not overpower 🙂

[Paul84]

11 minutes ago, Weissbock said:

note:  I'm paranoid on oxidation, if you have a c02 charger i would purge the carboy of oxygen before transfer, and top it off with more c02 before attaching airlock.  c02 charger is abkut $10.00 usd, well worth it.

Nice man , yeah I think I will give that a go , i want the cleanest Stout I can . This is rhe first brewprint I want to modify to keen to do a good job. 

Where in the states are you set up ? Do you find much conversation about the droid and brewart there ? 

[Paul84]

Also @Weissbock how do you do an OG on brewprints ? Keen to know because I would like to know what I am drinking to ABV would be good . So far I am just saying its what Brewart tells me it is lol 

[Weissbock]

good question... i would imagine brewarts og listings are correct, but what if using separately purchased ingredients?  I'd guess  drawing off the tap wouldn't really work well since ingredients are not mixed well into the water accurate readings would be off.  hmmm...!   Ive gotten my old brewing setup out again.... boiling, etc.  still the droid interests me.  Perhaps there is more info on this at the store site, video section.  great question!
I'm in alabama usa, sadly most things i read here are skeptical on droid.  Most are big believers in the boiling process and lack of options in the whole picture.  most people including myself like to know exactly what malts, hops, etc are going into the mix. better for custom recipes you know?  still i plan to buy one soon.

[Paul84]

I am personally the same @Weissbock. Was sceptical of the droid. Its a big outlay for a refridgerated fermenter. But think of it like that, i can still do BIAB or any other method of grain brewing to get the wort and then transfer to the droid for fermentation , temp control is one nice variable to take out. Where I live that is a struggle, most guys have to retrofit chest freezers to have temp controlled boxes for secondary fermentation etc. 

But for me , i love the convinience of it . The brewprints make tasty beer still and takes no time at all . Not putting aside a whole day for brewday 🙂 . I will say I am converted to the droid, every week i am finding a new way to adapt a recipe.

Edited December 3, 2019 by Paul84

[Paul84]

So my droid has become the hardest working in the pilbara . Bottled an Spoke Amber Ale today and thrown the RIS straight in 🙂 . Fingers crossed its an easy brew. It was hard putting all the ingredients today so much lol 

[Darran Haynes]

I've read this one ferments quite aggressively... only needs 9L and still prone to overflow (!).  Can't wait to try this one; probably in 1-2 brews time (might lay down some newspaper / cardboard first!).

[Captain 3 Droids]

That’s the way to go. An idle droid returns you nothing. Brew, brew, brew I say.

[Paul84]

6 minutes ago, Darran Haynes said:

I've read this one ferments quite aggressively... only needs 9L and still prone to overflow (!).  Can't wait to try this one; probably in 1-2 brews time (might lay down some newspaper / cardboard first!).

I have already put a chux down lol . The pineapple IPA was the same and made a messm have learnt from my mistakes lol 

[Captain 3 Droids]

Just now, Paul84 said:

I have already put a chux down lol . The pineapple IPA was the same and made a messm have learnt from my mistakes lol 

Yeah, you only need for it to happen once.

[Paul84]

Took 2 days but I have had a boil over 🙂

[Captain 3 Droids]

9 hours ago, Paul84 said:

Took 2 days but I have had a boil over 🙂

Fermentation has certainly taken off. Whilst it’s semi wet, moisten a cloth in starsan or similar and wipe clean as you go.

(I think you have the starsan on order, clean water will do for now. Don’t remove the lid.

Edited December 6, 2019 by Barrelboy

[Paul84]

Have wiped it down with a clean cloth and left the area right next to the overflow vent the way it is . But yeah lid is staying on , no need to take that off . 

[Paul84]

This has finished and now with the hops in for prebottling . Tomorrow morning (after night shift) i am planning to bottle this bad boy . So will let you know 😉

[Paul84]

Bottled The Kremlin today . Wont be touching one of these for atleast 3 months . Got 13 bottles in . 5 original RIS , 4 with 20ml of Makers Mark in ( not my favourite Bourbon but the tasting notes I desired... and smells delicious already) and 4 with Amrut Fusion ( a peated indian whisky) ... so far Amrut is gonna be a very experimental lol , all I can smell is smoke in the bottle haha. I think the ones with additions I will likely leave until I am doing my tax next year lol